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> Discussion of Windows Indexing / Windows Search 4, split from 22768 (Using Windows Explorer to Query Music Files)
Zerow
post Aug 24 2017, 16:28
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QUOTE (Doug Mackie @ Aug 8 2017, 23:48) *
Sometimes I do an indexed search from a Windows Explorer window using Advanced Query Syntax (AQS) . For example, when I want to search all of my music folders at once. That can be very slow in Mp3tag but is nearly instantaneous with an indexed search
[...]
I always viewed indexing of files as a slow down of the operating system; at last with the existing technology in form of Windows 7 X64 running with with HDDs / SSDs. And I deemed the Windows Explorer search [in Windows 7] as a defective one, using instead of it the search option in FreeCommander

So as for the alternative for indexing: https://forums.mp3tag.de/index.php?showtopic=22834
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poster
post Aug 24 2017, 16:53
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ZITAT(Zerow @ Aug 24 2017, 17:28) *
I always viewed indexing of files as a slow down of the operating system

It seems to me that your view is from the last century.
As indexing itself happens only on computers if they are idle, therefore there is no slow down but an increase in speed for daily use.
Without a database or an index there is no fast search.
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Zerow
post Aug 24 2017, 21:51
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QUOTE (Zerow @ Aug 24 2017, 17:28) *
I always viewed indexing of files as a slow down of the operating system
[...]


QUOTE (poster @ Aug 24 2017, 17:53) *
It seems to me that your view is from the last century.
As indexing itself happens only on computers if they are idle, therefore there is no slow down but an increase in speed for daily use.
Without a database or an index there is no fast search.
I am pretty sure that after migrating to Windows 7 from XP I have made some tests that resulted with such conclusion

And there are plenty of similar experiences as mine on the Internet https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&...0k1.8lg-HTQGgPw


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poster
post Aug 25 2017, 08:33
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@zerow
This is my final statement to your topic in this thread, because it is wandering away from the intention of the thread, which is to inform people of builtin windows-features that allow to overcome some MP3Tag disadvantages that are a result of the concept of this software:

There is no fast search for file content if there is no indexing or keeping everything in RAM.
To enable a fast search, which may be important for some tasks, it is therefore necessary to use indexing.

It can not be a solution to waste a lot of time for searching because someone fears that his OS needs some time in the background for indexing. Even if there would be a noticable slow down (which is not the case), the benefit of a fast search would be much much greater than any slow down during times when the user does not need full speed of the PC could occur.

Your conclusions in this thread tell me that you never used the AQS in the way it is described in this thread, otherwise you could not come to your conclusions.
Indexing in Windows is configurable in details to achieve the maximum for the personal needs.
So it would even be possible to just include only the folders with music-files for instance.
And naturally you have to include the folders in indexing where you want to use AQS, because otherwise it will be as slow as loading all files to MP3Tag.

The circumstance that you mention in another thread, that you start MP3Tag with every start of your computer loading all your music files , shows
- that you don't care about a possible slow down of your PC at all, and
- that you have a music library with less than about 50.000 files.

This thread is about AQS and its advantage of fast filtering and searching with builtin windows-features to overcome the natural disadvantages of MP3Tag as a 32 bit Windows-Software (limited use of builtin RAM) and no indexing or database feature.
Because of the limited use of RAM it maybe necessary to filter the files before loading them in MP3Tag and because of the enormal time it takes MP3Tag to load a large music-library it is desirable to sometimes filter before and loadi only parts of the music library.

This post has been edited by poster: Aug 25 2017, 08:40
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Doug Mackie
post Aug 25 2017, 15:34
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Thanks very much to Poster for your persuasive and comprehensive responses. I have just a few additions:

QUOTE
(Zerow @ Aug 24 2017, 17:28)
I always viewed indexing of files as a slow down of the operating system.

Windows Search 4 was introduced nine years ago and has been much improved since. In addition, PC speeds and resources have increased, minimizing any apparent slowdown from indexing. If I edit tags in Mp3Tag and then immediately restore focus to an Explorer window showing those files as search results, the results already reflect my edits. I don't even need to refresh the window! And that is on an Intel Core i5-2400 3.1 GHz PC that is almost five years old. My conclusion is that indexing is now fast and efficient, even on a midrange machine.

QUOTE
(Zerow @ Aug 24 2017, 17:28) And I deemed the Windows Explorer search [in Windows 7] as a defective one.

It's fine with me that you prefer a search application that does not index. But please don't label Windows Search as "defective" without furnishing evidence other than a list of complaints from the Internet. You can find complaints there about almost anything.

Windows Search is certainly not perfect, but I have shown that it can be a useful complement to Mp3tag. It doesn't make sense that members like Poster and LyricsView and myself, people with large collections, would tolerate a search program that bogged down our PCs or was "defective" by any serious measure.


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Zerow
post Aug 26 2017, 16:38
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QUOTE (poster @ Aug 25 2017, 09:33) *
[...]

The circumstance that you mention in another thread, that you start MP3Tag with every start of your computer loading all your music files , shows
- that you don't care about a possible slow down of your PC at all, and
You have misread / misunderstood

I never said I auto-start Mp3tag. On the contrary: very long time ago I stopped practicing such approach for almost all of software because of the problem you pointed out; and because ofsuch problem growing to something even badder when there is some problem with OS and I have to reboot many times in a short time [having possibly to have to stop those auto startings programs from executing themselves]

QUOTE (poster @ Aug 25 2017, 09:33) *
- that you have a music library with less than about 50.000 files.
Yes

That what I was about to point out- than I do not have problems with [the time it takes to] search or filter within Mp3tag or FreeCommander, with the amunt that I work on [not even 20 000]


I will now reconsider turning on indexing for my archive drive, where every couple of days I search for some [most of the time music] file; which now [without indexing] takes me a considerable amount of time as I have multiple copies of my music dating years back


QUOTE (poster @ Aug 25 2017, 09:33) *
This thread is about AQS and its advantage of fast filtering and searching with builtin windows-features to overcome the natural disadvantages of MP3Tag as a 32 bit Windows-Software (limited use of builtin RAM) and no indexing or database feature.
Because of the limited use of RAM it maybe necessary to filter the files before loading them in MP3Tag and because of the enormal time it takes MP3Tag to load a large music-library it is desirable to sometimes filter before and loadi only parts of the music library.
And that is also one of the reasons why I recently asked for users of Mp3tg to reveal the amount of files on which they operate upon: https://forums.mp3tag.de/index.php?showtopic=22693 [it wasn't verbalized back then but it was one of my reasons for that thread of mine]


QUOTE (Doug Mackie @ Aug 25 2017, 16:34) *
[...]
It's fine with me that you prefer a search application that does not index. But please don't label Windows Search as "defective" without furnishing evidence other than a list of complaints from the Internet. You can find complaints there about almost anything.

Windows Search is certainly not perfect, but I have shown that it can be a useful complement to Mp3tag. It doesn't make sense that members like Poster and LyricsView and myself, people with large collections, would tolerate a search program that bogged down our PCs or was "defective" by any serious measure.
Well it's a pity now that I cannot recall what were those problems with Search option in Windows Explorer, which were one of the two big reasons for me for switching to usage of FreeCommander and thus abandoning WE in its wholesome
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